MARGARET BRENNAN
South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham, who joins us from Seneca. Good morning to you, Senator.
SENATOR LINDSEY GRAHAM
Good morning. Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN
There’s a lot that still hasn’t been figured out here in this deal, but you wrote nine days ago the idea of a US plan with partners to create a fund of at least $300 billion- this is point six in the memorandum- is “tone deaf,” and it’s “akin to a Marshall Plan for Germany with the Nazis still in charge.” Why did you change your position–
SEN. GRAHAM
It would be–
MARGARET BRENNAN
–and now you support it?
SEN. GRAHAM
Because before, I thought the money was coming from the West. If the West funds Iran, I think that would be a Marshall Plan with a Nazi still in charge for Germany. If the plan envisions–
MARGARET BRENNAN
You’re okay if it doesn’t come from the U.S.?
SEN. GRAHAM
–the Sunni Arabs- yeah, if the Sunni Arabs do it. Can you imagine if Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates invest $300 billion in Iran? That would tell me that Iran has changed. To all the experts out there, do you think Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates are going to invest in Iran, with a theocracy bent on destroying Sunni Islam? So, think- think it through. If the money comes from the Sunni Arab world, I hope it happens. It would mean that the Sunni Arabs believe that Iran has changed to the point they want to be a business partner. I pray that happens. I doubt if it will.
MARGARET BRENNAN
You doubt if it will. Well, I want to ask you about some of the criticism of the agreement from your fellow Republican colleagues. Take a listen.
[START SOUND ON TAPE]
SENATOR TED CRUZ
If we give billions of dollars to Iran, that money will be used to murder Americans, and so I don’t believe we should do that.
SENATOR JOHN CORNYN
They’ll use the money that is being released to rebuild their- their ballistic missile arsenal and begin to enrich again, and that’s going to be a continuing danger.
SENATOR TOM COTTON
That money, Brooke, we know is not going to go to build new hospitals or daycares, it’s going to go to replenish their drone stockpiles, their missiles to support terrorists like Hezbollah and Hamas.
SENATOR BILL CASSIDY
We have 13 Americans dead. We spent anywhere from $25 to $100 billion in munitions and it turns out we’ve lost the credible threat of attacking them again. So, there’s a lot of stuff in there that’s bad.
[END SOUND ON TAPE]
MARGARET BRENNAN
All of those Republicans are seriously doubting the president here, Senator Graham. Do you agree with their concerns?
SEN. GRAHAM
No, I don’t. We’re not giving any money to Iran that can change the course of history to try diplomacy. Is the MOU problematic? Yeah. I’d rather try diplomacy than take it off the table. The money Iran gets is not going to change the future of Iran. It’s not enough to reconstruct the country. If you don’t have a diplomatic path through the MOU, then you have to go to war or some other form of coercion. Let’s try this. Let’s try a diplomatic solution. I think it’s going to fail. What happens next? I spent four-and-a-half hours with President Trump, Friday. Here’s what I think will happen next. If this deal fails, President Trump is going to take the Strait of Hormuz over by force. The United States will control the Strait of Hormuz. We’ll charge a fee for all those who go through- through to pay for the operation, and we’re going to expand the Abraham Accords in calendar year 2026. We’re going to get Saudi Arabia to join the Abraham Accords, and- which is the biggest change in 5,000 years in the Mideast. And if Iran contests control of the Strait of Hormuz by the United States, we will obliterate them. So, to all the people listening, if this diplomatic effort fails, President Trump is going to take the Strait of Hormuz.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
We’re going to run it. We’re going to try to get Saudi Arabia to join the Abraham Accords to end the Arab-Israeli conflict in 2026, and if Iran continues to attack Israel and Lebanon, the new policy will be, we’ll hit Iran. So, to the Iranians, if you’re listening, when you use Hezbollah to attack Israel, I think the new policy will be, we will attack Iran.
MARGARET BRENNAN
You have just laid out how you could turn what you think is a flawed document into an opportunity, but you’re also suggesting there that you can get Benjamin Netanyahu, or whoever is the next Prime Minister of Israel, to recognize the Palestinian state, which is the price of normalization with Saudi Arabia. How could you do that on the brink of an election?
SEN. GRAHAM
Well, for about two years, Margaret, in case you missed this, I went to Riyadh and Jerusalem, working on normalization with President Biden.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yes.
SEN. GRAHAM
We were going to announce a framework to have Saudi join the Abraham Accords, and- at the end of October in 2023. Iran attacked on October 7. That created a real problem. The Arab world is very upset about Gaza, and everybody in Israel is very upset about October 7, but we’re going to pick up where we left off. And Donald Trump is going to empower me and others to jump-start what we- an effort to get Saudi to join Israel. There will be accommodations made by Saudi and Israel. To Saudi and Israel, you have no better friend than Donald Trump. To Bibi, Donald Trump stood by you when other people wouldn’t. I’m not asking you to do anything to jeopardize the future of Israel’s security, but I am asking you to be open to expanding the Abraham Accords and finding a solution to Palestinians that are good for Israel, and quite frankly, good for the world. To the- to Saudi Arabia, now is the time to open negotiations yet again–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
–for you to expand the Abraham Accords, for you to join. I think this is going to happen in 2026–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Wow.
SEN. GRAHAM
–and it can’t happen until Iran’s in a box. If we get a deal, if we get a deal, Iran will be in a box. If we don’t get a deal–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
–Iran will be in a box. To Lebanon, to the people in Lebanon, help is on the way. Hezbollah has been terrorizing your country for–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yes.
SEN. GRAHAM
–a long time. That’s about to end.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Senator, I have other questions I need to get to based on your responsibilities in the Judiciary- in the Judiciary Committee. President Trump appeared to sabotage his own nominee, Jay Clayton, who was going to be the nominee with a confirmation hearing last week to run the Director of National Intelligence. He told him not to show up at his hearing, so that left Bill Pulte, this controversial head of the Federal Housing Agency, who has no prior intelligence background or security clearance, in charge. Are you comfortable with giving Pulte the keys to the 18 agencies?
SEN. GRAHAM
I think what we had in place should happen. I think Clayton should be the new DNI. President Trump was told that Democrats were not going to support FISA reauthorization, and he got mad and pulled out of the agreement. They will. Mark Warner told me that there are enough votes to get FISA reauthorized, and I would urge President Trump to let Clayton testify. And if we nominate Clayton and get him affirmed as the new DNI, we don’t want FISA to go dark. There’s too many threats to our country for 702 to go down. Anybody who owns the shutting down of 702 under FISA will own a future attack against the United States. We’re playing with fire here.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Did you- you said you spent time with President Trump this past week? Did he say to you that he will do what you just laid out?
SEN. GRAHAM
I’ll- I’ll let- I’ll let him speak for himself. But I told him that any Democrat that shuts down FISA at a time of great peril for the United States is making a huge mistake. The same would be true of the Trump administration. We need FISA up and running. So, here’s what I hope will happen: that Clayton will appear before the committee, we’ll get him confirmed, and we’ll get FISA reauthorized, as the original plan was. I think the Democratic votes are there. We’re playing with fire here, no matter what side does it.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
America needs FISA up and running.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Well, this- you’re talking about the surveillance tool that allows for foreigners of concern abroad to be–
SEN. GRAHAM
Yeah.
MARGARET BRENNAN
–monitored there.
SEN. GRAHAM
Yeah. Yes.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Bill- Bill Pulte–
SEN. GRAHAM
Yeah.
MARGARET BRENNAN
–went after the president’s perceived political enemies and is accused of using private mortgage data and weaponizing it. Mark Warner told us on this program last week, because he’s so ignorant, he could do damage. He’s on the job right now. Is he a risk?
SEN. GRAHAM
I’m fine right now, but I won’t be fine much longer if we don’t get FISA up and running, and I think Clayton’s the perfect pick.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Okay.
SEN. GRAHAM
Clayton has got the confidence of both sides.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
Let’s get him in a job that really matters. And I thought it was an outstanding–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Okay.
SEN. GRAHAM
–choice by President Trump and let’s get this–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Okay.
SEN. GRAHAM
–back on track. We can’t, you know–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah.
SEN. GRAHAM
–we gotta, we gotta–
MARGARET BRENNAN
Yeah, I gotta–
SEN. GRAHAM
–realize that their people want to blow us all up and kill us and they’re coming if–
MARGARET BRENNAN
I gotta wrap this.
SEN. GRAHAM
–we don’t stop them.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Okay.
SEN. GRAHAM
And if we don’t get Iran in a box, we’re in trouble. So, let’s do it.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Senator–
SEN. GRAHAM
Let’s stop talking and get it done.
MARGARET BRENNAN
Senator Graham, thank you very much. Got to go to a break. We’ll be right back.
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